need advice on Copal 228 restoration

[flipje]

I am restoring a Copal 228 and I found 2 self locking metal rings inside, which lock the face plate (black) to a small pillar (white). I managed to get some yarn underneath, but the ring is just burrowing into the plastic. Does anyone know, what is the preferred way to get these off? Or maybe someone can tell me what they are called. That might help the google search.

Also it had some noise similar to the 225 in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUBxBft5PSw

I applied the method shown in the video and it definitely made it better, but it is not completely gone. Is there any advantage to getting the whirlygig of to improve the noise issue even more? Is it worth the trouble? Any other advice on this?

[flipje]

I got impatient, so now I can answer my own question. Apparently they are called retaining rings, starlock washers or push nuts. You are supposed to open them with pliers by bending the leaves up one by one. That didn't work for me. Whatever method you use for deforming this metal part, it is going to damage the surrounding plastic way more.

I ended up using a 2mm diamond drill bit to weaken the ring at its thinnest part. Then when I tried to wiggle it, it snapped and came right off.

[flipje]

Let me share how I got the window out. It was pretty scary, because there is quite a force involved. Maybe I got lucky, but nothing broke.

There is no glue, nuts or clips. To get it in and out, you need to bend the window. You roughly bend it along the bend that the window already has.You push the outside in and start with the top left and right corner. Apply a counter force on the housing from the inside while doing this. Beware that you don't accidentally wipe the logo off.

[Johan de Jong]

These retaining rings are indeed horrible. I got them off somehow, but not in a way I would recommend. Clearly these were optimised for quick assembly and no disassembly.

I happen to also have a noisy Copal 228 and a few more Copal and Copal knock off motors (Artin and the like) that have the same problem. I also applied the method in the video. Sometimes it helps, but often the main cause is that the bushings have developed too much play. I'm now looking into whether I can replace these bushings, but that is still works in progress.

Thanks for sharing!

[flipje]

Cleaned, oiled, whitened and polished.I am happy with the results. The only thing keeping me from actually using it as an alarm clock, is the ticking motor. It is okay as a desk clock, but too loud for my nightstand. What is the best way to get a replacement motor? Is there a list of Copal models which have a compatible motor?

[Mackey]

Thanks for this post flipje. I've just ordered my fist 228 and this is likely to help a lot!

[flipje]

I hope you will do a video about the 228. I am especially interested in your opinion on build quality differences between different models/generations of flip clocks. I know Copal went from glass to plastic windows and also some later models replaced metal parts of the internals with plastic. Were the first Copals build to a higher standard than later ones?

I just finished restoring my 101 and compared to the 228 it just seemed more rigidly build. And now having them side by side, the flipping of the 228 sound clunky, while the 101 sounds more sophisticated. It could be just my clocks thought. I have only one of each... for now

[Mackey]

In the middle of making a video about the Copal 228. Here's a small piece about removing the clips.
(turn sound on)

I'll be looking to see what motor might be able to be used with this clock.

[Mackey]

The Clips
I didn't have to straighten them or anything - They came out great. I initially tried to see if they'd screw off - no luck there. But the method in the video works well, just have to watch out for flying objects.

Still working on the video and whitening. Thankfully we're in the midst of a bright sunshiny day.

The sun's coming in at such an angle that I had to hike out to the back yard to find a nice patch of sun. It seems to be whitening quickly.

I didn't have the guts to get the front clear piece out. Just couldn't bring myself to take the chance. I don't know if I'll see a 228 in the near future.

The Motor: It's definitely the same motor as the Copal Caslon 701 - I'll show this in the upcoming video. The only thing is that you'd need to swap out the brass gears on the gear boxes so that it would work on the 228.

[Mackey]

flipje Now that we know that the 228 has a 701 type motor, the recent problem I found and fixed with a 701 may be the cause of the noise you’re experiencing.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=mm_QCTSmZfQ

[flipje]

flipje Now that we know that the 228 has a 701 type motor, the recent problem I found and fixed with a 701 may be the cause of the noise you’re experiencing.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=mm_QCTSmZfQ

I am not sure it is the same problem.The clock is running on time and the clunky sound is only when it is flipping. Although I do remember that one of the gears was wobbly. I will investigate further when I have the time.

On a side note: I just noticed the before and after images of my restoration (post #7) are missing. Do you know why?

[Mackey]

No. I never saw the before and after shots.

[flipje]

The Clips
I didn't have to straighten them or anything - They came out great. I initially tried to see if they'd screw off - no luck there. But the method in the video works well, just have to watch out for flying objects.

Still working on the video and whitening. Thankfully we're in the midst of a bright sunshiny day.

The sun's coming in at such an angle that I had to hike out to the back yard to find a nice patch of sun. It seems to be whitening quickly.

I didn't have the guts to get the front clear piece out. Just couldn't bring myself to take the chance. I don't know if I'll see a 228 in the near future.

The Motor: It's definitely the same motor as the Copal Caslon 701 - I'll show this in the upcoming video. The only thing is that you'd need to swap out the brass gears on the gear boxes so that it would work on the 228.

I used a nail dryer instead of the sun. It is more reliable than the sun, but that off course depend on where you live. It was less than $10 delivered from AliExpress when it was on sale. As you can see the bottom is removable for easy illumination. It has a timer, but also an "always on"-mode. Together with some cheap mirror tiles from Ikea it did it's magic in less than a day.

[Mackey]

Just a thought. Possible causes of sounds.