Will a Whitened Flip Clock Return to Yellow - A four year case study

[Mackey]

In the comments of a video about whitening flip tiles, a visitor asked me to come back in a year to show if the clock had returned to yellow. I thought, I can do better ... I can come back in over 4 years and show you what happens. Well, not with the same clock.
You see, I did a video about a Caslon Mini-Mod (December 25, 2017) where I showed how I whitened it. The images below are from that video.




And now, what does the clock look like?


Well, .... There has been some notable discoloration. But it's not yet yellowed. It was on display for about 3 years but of course not in direct sunlight. So, was it worth it?
Absolutely! Even in it's current state it's whitened better than it was.

Of course the question is whether this is weakening the plastic. That's way beyond the scope of what I'm doing here, but I doubt it.
So I re-whitened the clock. You may find the very short video below interesting.


https://youtu.be/hEaoIF_g8dA

[Guest]

Repeated applications of concentrated peroxide solutions will make ABS more brittle over time. The chemical company below lists plastics and their ability to resist damage from %30 H202.

Chemical Resistance of Plastics to Hydrogen Peroxide @ 30%, 60°C (specialchem.com)

It would probably need to have several concentrated applications of the hair gel type (which is anywhere from %6 to %12+) to begin damaging anything. Example: 40 Volume hydrogen peroxide solution means 12% hydrogen peroxide. 1 ccm of solution releases 40 ccm of oxygen in %12 concentrate.

10 - %3
20 - %6
30 - %9
40 - %12
50 - %15

I know there are 60, 70 and 80 volume solutions, as well, but have never used them.

I have used 50 volume with no ill effects on white plastics.

[Jumblejeff]

This is the first time I remember a post about plastic returning back to yellow again.

That old white plastic is funny. Some of it whitens really nice, while others it just ok. I have had the Sony TFM-C450W ghostbuster’s clock whiten nicely then re-yellow pretty quickly. Others seem to hardly yellow at all. They all seem to lose some of the real bright whitening. I have always used the volume 40 with mostly good results. Leaving them outside in a sunny day with the V40 seems to really make a big difference.

[Guest]

Yeah, it seems to depend on the quality of the plastic source, I guess. I had a Precor 970, which is essentially a Sony 8FC-100 with square buttons, and it became terribly blotchy and turned a light gray when treated with Volume 40 or 50. I treated it 3 times and the blotchiness never went away. I know that some plastics can turn blotchy if the peroxide solution dries out on the plastic, but this was not the case on the Precor. It just had strange, low quality plastic, I guess.

[Mackey]

Repeated applications of concentrated peroxide solutions will make ABS more brittle over time. The chemical company below lists plastics and their ability to resist damage from %30 H202.

Chemical Resistance of Plastics to Hydrogen Peroxide @ 30%, 60°C (specialchem.com)

It would probably need to have several concentrated applications of the hair gel type (which is anywhere from %6 to %12+) to begin damaging anything. Example: 40 Volume hydrogen peroxide solution means 12% hydrogen peroxide. 1 ccm of solution releases 40 ccm of oxygen in %12 concentrate.

10 - %3
20 - %6
30 - %9
40 - %12
50 - %15

I know there are 60, 70 and 80 volume solutions, as well, but have never used them.

I have used 50 volume with no ill effects on white plastics.

This is very interesting, but the data is for when the clocks are exposed to the chemical at 60 C (140 degrees F). Plus, I'd like to know the time of exposure. I think the ratings are for when the plastic is intended to be in repeated or constant contact with the plastic - long term.
But still it's very interesting that this data out there.

[Mackey]

This is the first time I remember a post about plastic returning back to yellow again.

That old white plastic is funny. Some of it whitens really nice, while others it just ok. I have had the Sony TFM-C450W ghostbuster’s clock whiten nicely then re-yellow pretty quickly. Others seem to hardly yellow at all. They all seem to lose some of the real bright whitening. I have always used the volume 40 with mostly good results. Leaving them outside in a sunny day with the V40 seems to really make a big difference.

This man commented on my YouTube Video and in subsequent comments he reports that yellowed keyboards have gone back to yellow in a year. He's pretty sure its the composition of the plastic. It may be related to the amount of bromine containing chemicals added for fireproofing.

[Guest]

Yep, that was the best/only data I could find aside from opinions about retr0brite and so on (people CLAIM that it does make it brittle in their experience). I tend to believe them. Just thought it was interesting.

[Mackey]

It is interesting. But I'm a sceptic when it comes to people making pronouncements about stuff like that. It's like in the medical community, people try to use logic and then make a pronouncement. No one has done a study on this. I have been doing this for some time with no evidence of brittleness at all. Even did this mini-mod twice - no problems.

flipoclock was poking me the other day about a real yellowed copal 227 and I actually got it for a pretty good deal. I got it for the parts (including the little copal badge believe it or not). Clearly, the thing has never been opened or whitened, but the front piece breaks apart like glass. Something made this very, very brittle for some reason.

People could be trying to whiten something already brittle to begin with and don't even know it until they go messing around.

Anyway, it's an interesting topic and in another 4 years I'll whiten this clock again and well see how it goes.

[Guest]

It is interesting. But I'm a sceptic when it comes to people making pronouncements about stuff like that. It's like in the medical community, people try to use logic and then make a pronouncement. No one has done a study on this. I have been doing this for some time with no evidence of brittleness at all. Even did this mini-mod twice - no problems.

flipoclock was poking me the other day about a real yellowed copal 227 and I actually got it for a pretty good deal. I got it for the parts (including the little copal badge believe it or not). Clearly, the thing has never been opened or whitened, but the front piece breaks apart like glass. Something made this very, very brittle for some reason.

People could be trying to whiten something already brittle to begin with and don't even know it until they go messing around.

Anyway, it's an interesting topic and in another 4 years I'll whiten this clock again and well see how it goes.

Haha! So true...

But..I thought EVERYTHING on the Internetzez was the tRuTh!

[Mackey]

But..I thought EVERYTHING on the Internetzez was the tRuTh!

Right. If you say it often enough it is.
I'm thinking about doing an experiment. Leaving plastic from a flip clock in H2O2 for weeks and weeks. We may be surprised. It may actually soften it.

But anyway, here's a short members only video about my theory, plus my plans to whiten tiles on the wheel.

EDIT: Don't watch the above: Watch the updated video: